Russ: This is the BusinessMakers Show heard here and online at thebusinessmakers.com. And it's guest time on the show, and we have a very special repeat guest because with us now is Dr. Don Minnick, a principle with Interpersonal Skills Laboratory. Don, welcome back to theBusinessMakers Show.

Don: Thanks, Russ.

Russ: You bet. Dr. Minnick just happens to be an expert with a boatload of expert data on the whole world of downsizing and layoffs and reductions in force. And we're very pleased because Don brought in his brand, new recently published book, Survive Downsizing: How to Keep Your Job and Become Indispensable to Your Company. First off, congratulations.

Don: Well, thank you, Russ.

Russ: Well, let's start, for those that did not hear your first interview, and describe the history of the data that have just managed to collect along the way.

Don: Well, Russ, we actually started thinking about this a few years back during a previous period when downsizing and organization restructuring and outsourcing were becoming legitimate business strategies. So this was probably the 2001-2002 time period. And a lot of our clients at that time were folks who were really concerned about their jobs. They perhaps were in organizations for whom the viability of the company was in doubt. Maybe there had been a round of downsizing already; there were rumors that more were in the mill. And these folks were really wondering what they needed to do to increase their chances for survival in their organization. What we did, Russ, was we decided to survey a lot of the people in our client systems, and we focused specifically on people who had actually survived a round of downsizing, and the hiring managers who selected them to stay. And we asked them some specific questions about what kinds of skills, competencies, abilities make employees valuable contributors in their organizations. When they were selecting people to stay, what kinda things specifically did they look for?

Russ: So you developed a database of the answers to those questions.

Don: We did. We did. And we built a model around that.

Russ: Okay. Well, I know that we probably have a lot of people right up front that are wanting to know what in the world (Laughs) are those competencies and skills, particularly in this economic climate that we live in today.

Don: Well, the model that we developed became kind of robust right away. The first thing that seemed to fall out was that there were two particular core competencies, and we called these "survival instincts." And those two things are personal initiative and the capacity for collaboration. Now as you might imagine, personal initiative is simply seeing what needs to be done in an organization and setting about to do it. Capacity for collaboration is that ability and inclination to include other people when that's appropriate, to really multiply the impact and the ability for innovation in the organization. So those were kinda the two key central competencies that this model revolves around.

Russ: Meaning that you heard those pop up time and time again for what the decision-makers were looking for to decide who to keep and who to let go.

Don: Exactly so. And those seem to be, as I said, preferential ways of working. They were broad-brush orientations to doing work in a particular kind of way.

Russ: Okay. And just for us that (Laughs) that want to hear those reemphasized, they were personal initiative and capacity for collaboration.

Don: That's correct.

Russ: Okay. So those continued to follow you through as you got deeper into the data, and I assume those two certainly show up in your book, Survive Downsizing.

Don: They do. And there are actually four more specific skill sets that grow from those two competencies, and let me mention what those are. Right away, a quality that we're calling "mental agility," seemed to spring forward. And mental agility, again, in broad-brush terms is simply a quickness in thought and action, combined with an ability to act on calculated risks. Folks who have that skill set in place, who can do those kinds of things really have an advantage in today's organization. So mental agility, very important skill set.

A second one that comes from that personal initiative instinct is something that we're calling "visible competence." And visible competence is, as it implies, someone who is seen in their organization as kind of the go-to person, the person who is widely known as competent, the person who gets things done in the organization.

Russ: That sounds very important, particularly when decisions like these are being made. Okay, visible competence.

Don: Yeah. And the important thing about that is you can be the most competent technical person in your organization, but if that competence is invisible, as it is for some folks, that does you no good; it does your organization no good. So you really have to take the opportunity to make your competence visible widely in the organization.

Russ: Okay. What's No. 3?

Don: No. 3 is something that we're calling "boundary spanning," and boundary spanning is simply the ability to build personal connections across the boundaries in the organization. Now those could be functional boundaries from one function in the organization to the other, and they could be those boundaries where the organization bumps up against the larger environment, boundaries with customers, boundaries with suppliers, with regulators, and the ability to kind of build personal connections across those boundaries was very important.

Russ: Okay. So the guy that says, 'It's not my job," he would rank low in boundary spanning?

Don: Exactly so, exactly so. And it's not necessarily getting into other people's business. But it's simply building connections so that you know folks across those boundaries that you can connect with when that's appropriate.

Russ: Okay. And what's No. 4?

Don: The final thing is something that we're calling "action learning." And action learning is simply the inclination and the ability to learn from organizational actions, to take what the organization does, to draw learning from those activities and to be able to apply that learning more broadly across other types of activities that the organization engages in.

Russ: Okay. So these four more-detailed characteristics are mental agility, visible competence, boundary spanning, and action learning, right?

Don: That's correct.

Russ: Sounds real cool. We're gonna be back with more with Don Minnick, an expert at surviving downsizing, after this. You're listening to the BusinessMakers Show, heard here and online at thebusinessmakers.com.

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Russ: This is the BusinessMakers Show, heard here and online at thebusinessmakers.com. And continuing with Dr. Don Minnick, the expert in surviving downsizing, a very popular topic these days. So, Don, I assume that there's probably some employees out there listening that have managed to survive a couple of rounds away, but are really tuned into this, and perhaps even taking notes. It almost seems like that's where your expertise applies most efficiently.

Don: Well, Russ, obviously, the book was written with that person in mind, that person who wanted to really increase their chances for holding onto the job that they had, what kinda things did they need to do to make themselves valuable contributors in their organization. So we wrote the book with them in mind. But since the book has come out, we've been getting some feedback that there are other applications to this model as well. And if I could, I'd like to just talk about those a little bit.

Russ: Absolutely.

Don: For a lotta folks, the worst has happened. They've lost their jobs.

Russ: There's a bunch of those.

Don: There are. We believe that this book has something to offer them as well. As the recovery occurs, which we all believe and hope that it will, these people wanna be able to distinguish themselves from that crowd of jobseekers that are looking for those good jobs that are out there. And I believe that this model has something to say to them as well. Matter of fact, we have a whole chapter in the book that's devoted to: How do you structure a resume so that it speaks specifically to these survival skills that hiring managers have told us they're looking? How do you handle interview questions that highlight survival skills? And those kinda things are gonna put you at the forefront of the jobseekers who are out there.

Russ: So these might be people that were just laid off in the last year and they're out there scrambling try to get a job. Your point is that they can use a lot of the information in your whole methodology about capturing and winning a new job.

Don: That's exactly right.

Russ: Okay. Now I know when hear these terms like "visible competence," and, "mental agility," and, "action learning," if somebody came in and was interviewing with me and came across like that, man, they'd be making straight A's from me.

Don: Yeah. I think it's very important that you, again, be able to speak those skills that hiring managers are looking.

Russ: Right. You mentioned recovery. I assume that there will be a point where we'll start hearing real good labor statistics, but it's still gonna be competitive to land a job.

Don: Absolutely. One of the things that's happened in organizations as they've resized and become leaner is they are doing more and more work with fewer and fewer people. So what becomes important even when you've landed that new job, now whether you're a veteran employee or somebody who's starting their career, real important that you understand: How do you distinguish yourself right away in that job? How do you use your first 100 days to begin to build a reputation as somebody who is gonna be indispensible to that company? And we believe this model has something to say to help you make that transition.

Russ: Okay. Well, I assume some of it takes some time, though. You can't be boundary spanning when you don't know where the boundaries are yet, right?

Don: Exactly so. And one of the things that we try to point out in the book is kind of a strategy for how you do that, what kind of things come first. Of these skills, of these instincts, which ones do you put in place early on?

Russ: And what is that?

Don: Well, I think you have to start right away with the kind of core of the model, those instincts, personal initiative and capacity for collaboration to be able to build those relationships right from Day 1.

Russ: I would assume that somebody might (Laughs) be taking notes right now because this stuff really obviously could have a positive impact on how you start your new position with the company.

Don: Yeah, yeah. It sure does, Russ. And one other thing that we've been getting some feedback from our consulting clients and that is although the book was written primarily with individuals in mind, you might imagine that an organization full of people who are displaying the kind of skills we're talking about is gonna be an organization that is performing at a high level. So we've been getting some requests to tailor this model to fit particular organizations' own competency model and begin to do some training about building these sort of interpersonal skills, the system skills and system understanding to make the organization function more successfully.

Russ: Well, I think that actually makes sense. If you had your whole organization that showed all this personal initiative and capacity for collaboration, you might not even have to go through a reduction in force. You might be winning. I tell you, I thought that, Don, the very first time that we interviewed you and had you in here. These things, all of 'em, are characteristics and really sort of initiatives that seem like, man, they'd make a person into a great employee right up front.

Don: Well, we think they do. And I think the important thing to know here is these ideas didn't come out of our heads. These ideas came from people who had actually experienced this, survivors of downsizing, and hiring managers who provided the data that said, "These are the kinda people we're looking for."

Russ: Okay, cool. We're talking to Dr. Don Minnick, a principle with Interpersonal Skills Laboratory, and we'll be back with more with him after this. You're listening to the BusinessMakers Show, heard here and online at thebusinessmakers.com.

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Russ: This is the BusinessMakers Show, heard here and online at thebusinessmakers.com. And continuing on with surviving downsizing expert, Dr. Don Minnick, also author of the book called Survive Downsizing. So, Don, tell us about the book. Everybody that has been tuned in and listening to this has probably been taking notes. What else can they pick up in the book that we haven't covered here right now?

Don: Yeah. One real important thing that I wanted to mention is that in every chapter in the book, we have developed self-assessment instruments for each of the two survival instincts, and the four survival skills. So in every chapter, readers can assess their own competencies in those areas, and then the remainder of the chapter is full of activities, of developmental steps that they can take to begin to build those skills today in their organization.

Russ: Alright. So we've got some listeners out there that might be interested in picking up the book. Where could one find it?

Don: Well, right now you can buy it at really anyplace you can buy books. It's available at amazon.com, barnesandnoble.com, and you can order it at any bookstore.

Russ: Okay. And it's Survive Downsizing: How to Keep Your Job and Become Indispensable to Your Company, by Donald Minnick, PhD. Cool. Before we let everybody go, I think that we should review those two broad-based initiatives which are –

Don: Personal initiative and capacity for collaboration. And we're referring to those as survival instincts because they are broad general ways of working, kind of work preferences, if you will.

Russ: Okay. And the more detailed survival skills.

Don: Yeah. The more specific skill sets are mental agility, visible competence, boundary spanning, and action learning.

Russ: Okay, real cool. Don, I really appreciate you visiting with us again and sharing the launch of your new book. And I actually feel great about having you here because I think we have members in our audience that could really benefit from your expertise.

Don: Well, Russ, I want to thank you for having me on once again, and it's been a pleasure.

Russ: You bet. That's Dr. Donald Minnick, principle with Interpersonal Skills Laboratory, and author of Survive Downsizing. You're listening to the BusinessMakers Show here and online at theBusinessMakers.com.